The Joel on Software Discussion Group (CLOSED)

A place to discuss Joel on Software. Now closed.

This community works best when people use their real names. Please register for a free account.

Other Groups:
Joel on Software
Business of Software
Design of Software (CLOSED)
.NET Questions (CLOSED)
TechInterview.org
CityDesk
FogBugz
Fog Creek Copilot


The Old Forum


Your hosts:
Albert D. Kallal
Li-Fan Chen
Stephen Jones

150,000 gone at IBM? That's a good start.

http://www.pbs.org/cringely/pulpit/2007/pulpit_20070504_002027.html

Clearly these IBM people are behind the times, compared to employees of Google and Apple. Hell, IBM doesn't even have an  initiative to leverage the Web 2.0 paradigm properly.

Their "play it safe" attitude is now causing them to reap the rewards they obviously deserve.

IBM has created nothing really useful in the past few years. They jumped on Sun's bandwagon by embracing the Java, and they jumped on the Linux bandwagon because their own operating systems (AIX, OS/2) are slow and inferior. Where's the IBM innovation that they so fervently boast about? Where are their quad-core processors? Where are their AJAX development tools? Where? Can I create a de.lic.io.us with WebSphere? How about a Flickr or a YouTube? Nope.

This was overdue. Well, they did it to themselves. In any case, the job market will quickly absorb these 'professionals'. Although I wouldn't want any working at my firm.
See this watch? It costs more than your car.
Friday, May 04, 2007
 
 
"an  initiative to leverage the Web 2.0 paradigm properly."
corporate speak rulez!
Friday, May 04, 2007
 
 
Swapping US employees for Indian a few at a time.  Wise, if you want to have a cost base that lets you bid against Infosys & friends.
economista
Friday, May 04, 2007
 
 
"It is especially disconcerting for an action of this scale to take place at a time when many companies (including IBM) are complaining about a shortage of technical workers to justify a proposed expansion of H1B and other guest worker visa programs. What's wrong with all those U.S. IBM engineers that they can't fill the local technical labor demand? They can't be ALL bad: after all, they were hired by IBM in the first place and retained for years.

What is unstated in this H1B aspect of the story is not that technical workers are unavailable but that CHEAP technical workers are unavailable. Lopping off half the technical staff, as Global Services is apparently about to do, will eliminate much of the company's traditional wisdom and corporate memory in an act that some people might label as age discrimination."
grover
Friday, May 04, 2007
 
 
I'm 95% sure the OP is satire, but just incase it's not . . .

"Where are their quad-core processors?"

They released one in 2001, along with an eight core processor. And the processor wasn't even the impressive part: it was the system architecture that was really cool.
28/w
Friday, May 04, 2007
 
 
> it was the system architecture that was really cool.

Sweet.  How so?
Obvi Petros
Friday, May 04, 2007
 
 
It was often said of SCO that, when a company's line of business is suing its customers, it's a sign of the end.

I'd like to inaugurate a new sign, namely when a company's main line of business is re-organizing itself to up its stock price.

The question in my mind is how 150,000 competent engineers can't see this going on around them long before it shows up in the press.  My mid-size employer just got swallowed by a Fortune 500, and the difference in organizational maneuvering is palpable.  How can you not be cynical enough to see this coming?
Anon
Friday, May 04, 2007
 
 
Three years ago I worked for a giant, lumbering company.  I saw the end of our department coming for about two years. I stayed around long enough to get a very, very nice severance package. My house is now payed off. So Anon, they might all see it coming.
XYZZY
Friday, May 04, 2007
 
 
tiki
Saturday, May 05, 2007
 
 
"Hell, IBM doesn't even have an  initiative to leverage the Web 2.0 paradigm properly."

Are you Mr. Paul Graham?
.
Saturday, May 05, 2007
 
 
"they jumped on the Linux bandwagon because their own operating systems (AIX, OS/2) are slow and inferior"

So, you think AIX is slow and inferior than Linux? Come on...
not an IBM fan, but...
Saturday, May 05, 2007
 
 
> Come on...

Was that all you wanted to offer as far as evidence?
Lenny
Saturday, May 05, 2007
 
 
Walmart is an AIX shop.  As someone who has occasion to offer support to their IT department, I can say that AIX is handling ginormous loads processing sales and financial data.  If linux could compete, I doubt that Walmart would hesitate to switch.
Anon
Saturday, May 05, 2007
 
 
" If linux could compete, I doubt that Walmart would hesitate to switch."

really? If AIX and Linux were merely competitive performance wise you think Walmart would take on the enormous switching costs?  Seems unlikely to me...
logic is not the best Send private email
Saturday, May 05, 2007
 
 
Walmart is a ...

http://www.informationweek.com/news/showArticle.jhtml;jsessionid=VGCMI2Q2G1DWCQSNDLRCKH0CJUNN2JVN?articleID=197000287

Wal-Mart Stores said Wednesday that it has tapped Microsoft and Novell to provide open source Linux software for use in the mega-retailer's internal computing and Web site operations.
ugly facts Send private email
Saturday, May 05, 2007
 
 
Quantas on the other hand

"We're moving from a Linux platform to an IBM AIX environment -- we did that to address some stability issues we were having," said Suzanne Young, Qantas group general manager for finance improvement and segmentation. The decision was made last year, as part of the planning for the rollout.

http://www.zdnet.com.au/news/software/soa/Qantas-ditches-Linux-for-AIX/0,130061733,339275100,00.htm
ugly facts Send private email
Saturday, May 05, 2007
 
 
Stability issues? I thought Quantas never crashed.
sloop
Sunday, May 06, 2007
 
 
It is Qantas - No "u". It originated as Queensland and Northern Territory Air Service.

And no, they haven't crashed, but the private equity fund's plan to take them private sure has.
ThomasH Send private email
Sunday, May 06, 2007
 
 
I heard they have a chance at the 2 week extension.

If it fails, should I short the stock?

http://au.finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=QAN.AX&t=1y&l=on&z=m&q=l&c=%5EAORD
baker b Send private email
Sunday, May 06, 2007
 
 
Yes. You most definately should take investment advice from anonymous geeks posting on the internet. Short away. No warranty or liability implied extended offered or accepted. Advice void on planets containing di-hydrogen monoxide and/or bipedal carbon-based organic neural networks. If advice is faulty, return to point of purchase for the amusement of anyone interested. If this advice satisfied you, try asking legal questions without the expense of actually talking to someone competent. If not, then try asking for legal advice on the itnernet as well.

Sunday, May 06, 2007
 
 
> their own operating systems (AIX, OS/2) are
> slow and inferior

As someone who developed for OS/2 for many years, I found it greatly superior to Windows. Windows NT 3.1 and 4.0 where nothing but a poor clones of OS/2.

The GDI layer (which, as a software developer was optional) was slow, but rumours are it was written by the Microsoft developers ;)

IMHO the reason OS/2 failed was IBM management has always see itself as a Fortune 500 'big iron' hardware and services company, not a 'mums and dads' PC company like Microsoft.
Jussi Jumppanen
Sunday, May 06, 2007
 
 
> IMHO the reason OS/2 failed was IBM management has always see itself as a Fortune 500 'big iron' hardware and services company, not a 'mums and dads' PC company like Microsoft.

They're just providing us with a rather large parallel computing facility (~2000 quad core processors, 500TB of storage, that kind of job) which somewhat backs up this claim.
Brian
Monday, May 07, 2007
 
 
There's a story in the April 7th issue of The Economist about IBM's restructuring, perhaps this is where Cringeley got his info.

A good quote from TFA:

>> The third model, argues Mr Palmisano, the IBM he is now building, is the "globally integrated enterprise". Rather than have a parent with lots of Mini-Mes around the world, such a firm shapes its strategy, management and operations as a single global entity.  It puts people and jobs anywhere in the world "based on the right cost, the right skills and the right business environment.  And it integrates those operations horizontally and globally".  In this approach, "work flows to the places where it will be done best", that is, most efficiently and to the highest quality.  The forces behind this "are irresitable", he says.  "The genie's out of the bottle and there's no stopping it" <<
xampl Send private email
Monday, May 07, 2007
 
 
>>Swapping US employees for Indian a few at a time. 

That's not new.

An Indian classmate of mine, fairly new to the US, landed an internship a year or so ago at an IBM office in the Bay Area and commented to me how nice it was to be working with so many Indians there.
anon y mouse
Monday, May 07, 2007
 
 

This topic is archived. No further replies will be accepted.

Other recent topics Other recent topics
 
Powered by FogBugz