The Joel on Software Discussion Group (CLOSED)

A place to discuss Joel on Software. Now closed.

This community works best when people use their real names. Please register for a free account.

Other Groups:
Joel on Software
Business of Software
Design of Software (CLOSED)
.NET Questions (CLOSED)
TechInterview.org
CityDesk
FogBugz
Fog Creek Copilot


The Old Forum


Your hosts:
Albert D. Kallal
Li-Fan Chen
Stephen Jones

Is a Dale Carnegie course worth the money?

I read in one of the threads below a coulpe of posts about taking a Dale Carnegie course to improve speaking skills.  I looked it up and they are offering a course in my area, but it costs $2000!  I doubt I would be able to get my employer to pay for it, is it REALLY that good to invest $2000 in it?
Gus
Thursday, April 12, 2007
 
 
Only if you think it can net you a $2000+ increase in annual salary. Otherwise, just go with Toastmasters.
Allen David
Thursday, April 12, 2007
 
 
IMHO, you're far better off joining an organization such as Toastmasters or Rostrum.    Not only is it drastically cheaper but you will also have ongoing opportunities to give speeches and presentations in a supportive environment.    There's a limited amount you can learn from a single short course because it takes time to build these skills.
dot Send private email
Thursday, April 12, 2007
 
 
If I remember correctly, Dale Carnegie also wrote a book called "How to Win Friends and Influence People."  I would suggest going to your local library and check this book out and read it.  If you think the material in this book is good, then consider the Dale Carnegie seminar.  If you think it was less than good, you may than have your answer on the worth/cost of $2000. 

Happy reading.
I forgot my posting name.
Thursday, April 12, 2007
 
 
What you will get from DC course is a booklet with cliff notes from the books, usually they just copy the lists (if you want to do this, follow these steps...).  I took the course first and then I bought the books, the books are better.  The good point of the course is that it offers practice, but you can get that at TM.  So books+TM should do it.

Also there are lots of DC (don't remember exact titles):

- how to win friends
- how to talk in public
- how to eliminate worry
- etc.

What I didn't like is that sometimes they would get into "used car salesman" techniques.  Pretend that you're interested to make your sale, praise anything about the other person to make your sale, etc.  Maybe that was an innovation back then, but now people see through it...anyway start with the books and see if you like what you see.
anon no more
Thursday, April 12, 2007
 
 
In a word, Yes, worth every penny. Before I took the course, I thought it was a bunch of BS. The course is rather ingenious and occurs over a 12 week period, giving you time to reflect and improve. Great environment and proven success record.

It will improve not only your ability to speak, but to relate to others. And in my case, people noticed the improvement and commented upon it. My boss described it as "finishing school for executives". I did not experience any "salesman-y" exercises noted above.

The book is not a replacement for the course. It's a good companion (and they give you a hardbound copy when you go), but nothing can replace the experience of attending the course.

Never been to Toastmasters so I can't comment on that. Then again I no longer feel the need to go to TM as I got everything I wanted from the DC course.

* Disclaimer, not affiliated with Dale Carnegie, and not a Kool-Aid drinker, but this course is a good one.
deaux
Thursday, April 12, 2007
 
 
It's definitely worth more to your professional career than going to some Java conference for $3500.
Meghraj Reddy
Thursday, April 12, 2007
 
 
The book was an excellent thing for me, helped my career a lot.  I work in an environment that likes to cast blame, where management has an adversarial relationship with the employees.  And yet I rarely receive the direct fire from irritated management.  The techniques I use to do this are direct from How To Win Friends and Influence People.

The sales things, it's easy to take out of context and interpret them as "being a fake smiling jerk to sell at any cost."  That's now what they're recommending, and if you do that you'll get the expected results--everyone will think you're a phony and stay away.  They're saying to find something genuinely likable or good about the person that you can say.  Some thing in their position or about them that you agree with.  Use that to establish common ground, so you can learn about them, what their needs and desires are, what you have to offer them that would be genuinely useful or desirable for them.
Clay Dowling Send private email
Thursday, April 12, 2007
 
 
Also read the Cialdini book "Influence: The psychology of pursuasion"
Michael H. Pryor Send private email
Thursday, April 12, 2007
 
 
>"How to Win Friends and Influence People."

If possible, get your hands on an early edition, before the book was "modernized".
dot for this one
Thursday, April 12, 2007
 
 
>to take out of context

Classic example: Carnegie's recommendation to use people's names in conversation.

Good usage: Hi, Joe, how was your vacation? -- to a returning coworker

Bad Usage: Well, Dot, the reason I'm calling you is to let you know of an outstanding mortgage program. You see, Dot, if you had a zero-down interest ...  -- any kind of annoying used car sales type.
dot for this one
Thursday, April 12, 2007
 
 

This topic is archived. No further replies will be accepted.

Other recent topics Other recent topics
 
Powered by FogBugz