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Quickest way to make CRUD enterprise applications? Generators?

Could anyone point me the quickest way of making enterprise CRUD applications?

Tools, languages? Both web and desktop considered. Would prefer Java.

Cheers.
John Cribbon
Thursday, May 17, 2007
 
 
If .NET is ok, take a look at the CSLA framework.
DaVinci
Thursday, May 17, 2007
 
 
Radu Chindris Send private email
Thursday, May 17, 2007
 
 
Enterprise CRUD...  wow, that was almost too easy.

If you're looking for CRUD-support things for Java, the hands down favorite is Hibernate.  Combine that with Spring and you can have some basic functionality pretty quickly*.


*  Pretty quickly by Java standards.
KC Send private email
Thursday, May 17, 2007
 
 
That's the problem "by Java standards". :-)

Anything faster, I am looking almost for a high-fidelity prototyping tool that generates output in one of "enterprise-acceptable" languages.
John Cribbon
Thursday, May 17, 2007
 
 
Ironspeed is a complete ASP.NET application generator that generates either C# or VB (1.1/2.0). It also generates SQL for either Access (2000/2002/2003), SQL Server (2000/2005), or Oracle (9i/10g):
http://www.ironspeed.com/ 

I've been using it for over a year. It has its distinct quirks, and I wouldn't use it for large volumes of data, but otherwise it's been quite good.
Mark Pearce Send private email
Thursday, May 17, 2007
 
 
Keep in mind that the expressions "quickest" and "enterprise" are subjective.

For example, if you're creating a basic content management system and you need to have it up tomorrow, downloading a Wiki is about as fast as you can get. If you need it by next week, Ruby on Rails was built for this kind of stuff. If you've got a month to play around with it, Visual Studio and ASP.NET is pretty powerful.

I'd imagine Ironspeed is somewhere between RoR and VS/ASP.NET but I've never tried it. (Thanks for the tip.)

But as others have pointed out, there are tradeoffs. Wikis are very hard to extend for example.
TheDavid
Thursday, May 17, 2007
 
 
Err... I know Java is preferred, but Java is not the ideal language for rapid prototyping, hence the lack of "build a site in one day" options. Keep in mind that portability (Java's strength) and prototype...ability are somewhat exclusive.

There's nothing that says you can't prototype something in RoR, determine your actual requirements and then reimplement it - the correct way - in Java.
TheDavid
Thursday, May 17, 2007
 
 
AppFuse is an excellent base for starting a new Java enterprise application. But I agree with others, for most basic CRUD sites, you're better off with a rapid prototyping language like Ruby+RoR.
Benjamin Manes Send private email
Thursday, May 17, 2007
 
 
Take a look at Subsonic DAL
clasp
Monday, May 21, 2007
 
 
If Java is a must -- Oracle's JDeveloper with ADF will get you CRUD quickly.  It can serve as a RAD framework that tries to relegate coding to special cases.  You point to a table, create an entity mapping (corresponding to rows), you create a view over that (corresponding to query), you create a Data Component wrapper over that (which exposes view to GUI tools), you drag the Data Component onto a page, you tell it you want it to be a Form, or a Table, or a Create Form, and you are pretty much done.  You can fine tune any bit of this puzzle through wizards or through code.

Once you try to do anything fancy, you'll need to really learn the tool.  Here's where Leaky Abstractions come in (look up Joel on Software / Leaky Abstractions). 

Free to try -- check sites for license requirements.
Ed Schechter Send private email
Tuesday, May 22, 2007
 
 
To get Rails type productivity on the JVM take a look at Grails:

http://grails.codehaus.org/
Ged Byrne Send private email
Tuesday, May 22, 2007
 
 
Uggh.... I hate people who use "generators" to create CRUD apps.

Apps should NOT be DATA CENTRIC. They should be USER CENTRIC. Thus, it is not possible to create a good user-friendly application by generating it off of the data model. All you will end up with is a bunch of table driven excel-like screens that do not even come close to matching the user's understanding of the tasks that they need to perform.

Why don't you just give them a command line tool to run raw SQL off of the database instead while you are at it. It would be just about as user friendly as what you intend to make.

Do us all a favor and read up on inductive user interfaces before you create yet another colossal failure of an app.
sick of code generation monkeys
Tuesday, May 22, 2007
 
 
Clarion is the fastest I know of.
Maybe this
Tuesday, May 22, 2007
 
 
>> Do us all a favor and read up on inductive user interfaces before you create yet another colossal failure of an app. <<

Do us all a favour and read up on modern code generation techniques before you create yet another colossal failure of a critique.
Mark Pearce Send private email
Wednesday, May 23, 2007
 
 
Well when you show me a "modern" code generator that can create code with complex, varrying business rules and task based user interfaces based off of real world usage patterns instead of just a database schema then I will retract my statement. Until then, you appear to be just another code generation monkey who doesn't "get it". Take a REALLY hard look at the CRUD apps you are generating and tell me that they aren't just a bunch of tabular screens on top of tabular data with no concern for the user's own understanding of the tasks that need to be accomplished with the software.

Unless of course you were referring to actual PROGRAMMERS when you mentioned "modern day code generators".
sick of code generation monkeys
Friday, May 25, 2007
 
 
>> Well when you show me a "modern" code generator that can create code with complex, varrying business rules and task based user interfaces based off of real world usage patterns instead of just a database schema then I will retract my statement. <<

Ironspeed can do all of this. You can build from database views as well as tables, or even from ad-hoc SQL queries. You can also override base classes (using inheritance) to add your business functionality. Finally, you can combine "panels" to create very customisable screens.

>> Until then, you appear to be just another code generation monkey who doesn't "get it". <<

A code generation monkey who was paid more than $300K last year <shrug>.

Because I deliver real business value, rather than being a precious coding snowflake who has to craft hand-built crap every time you're asked to actually deliver something.
Mark Pearce Send private email
Friday, May 25, 2007
 
 
Getting back to the original topic -:)

Suggest you take a look at Servoy - www.servoy.com/

Java based RAD tool that Links to just about any SQL databases and creates Rich Client and Web based solutions very efficiently.

Hope this useful
Graham Greensall Send private email
Sunday, May 27, 2007
 
 
you can take a try of appfuse
chenqizhi Send private email
Sunday, May 27, 2007
 
 

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