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Have google stopped ranking Commercial software sites on page 1?

I open this thread to continue in more focus what we started here:
http://discuss.joelonsoftware.com/default.asp?biz.5.854149.7

Alexandar wrote there:
"After all they publicly speak of being in disfavor of sites whose main purpose is to sell something"

My Reply was:
1)Where have you read that?
2)In my niche all the commercial sites (except one) are not in first page anymore for the main keyword  for the type of the commercial software.
All you get in first page are blogs, youtube, wiki, some other sites like wiki AND MANY (2-3) results from cNet (most of them are for free softwares in the same niche).
I assumed it is only in my niche but now you say it is general?

Anybody else noticed it?
That the commercial sites that develops the software are not in first page anymore and first page are all cNet, blogs, wiki and such?
I see 60% drop in traffic ever since that started.
 
And as side note for Cnet, have you noticed that most if not all results from cNet that started to popup on google first page are for software were cNet installer is embedded? You can see that if you go to the cnet software page and there in the green download button you will see 'cNet installer embedded'.
Could be that cNet and google signed some agreement where google sends traffic to cnet and cnet gives them some share in the toolbars revs their embedded installer installs?

If they first result page started to contain Cnet, wiki, blogs, youtube, other info sites instead of the commercial software sites that used to be for years on page one then please share here your experience.
 
I would love to here from you about this issue.
Not Now Send private email
Saturday, July 13, 2013
 
 
Well they say fucking Panda will affect 3.2 % of queries...
So no regularity can be established by doing manual research on different queries...Because if you search for say 'zip compression' and win zip pops up first you will say 'lucky bustards haven't been affected at all'. If a blog be first you will say 'so winzip too is among 3.2 %...'
All I'm saying is that it is utterly ridiculous to try to figure out what google is doing. Nice fools they make of us.

And by the way winzip is too well known to be taken for Spam by mistake, that is small business like ours that suffer from Google's nonchalance.
alexandar Send private email
Saturday, July 13, 2013
 
 
This google has become too big an unknown factor in on-line business. You can't plan ahead at all. It is all depending on them and their whims.
There is no similar thing in other walks of business... Just imagine getting a bank loan on condition that interest may be anywhere between 5% and 75% depending on random fluctuations and imperfections of their software...
alexandar Send private email
Saturday, July 13, 2013
 
 
>  Just imagine getting a bank loan on condition that interest may be anywhere between 5% and 75% depending on random fluctuations

That's variable mortgage for ya.
Vladimir Dyuzhev Send private email
Saturday, July 13, 2013
 
 
Google will always do what's best for Google.
Scorpio Send private email
Saturday, July 13, 2013
 
 
I have opened a new inquiry about the possibility to drop GA:

http://discuss.joelonsoftware.com/default.asp?biz.5.854184.0
Franco Graziosi Send private email
Saturday, July 13, 2013
 
 
I have website over 14 years for my paid product. Since June 12 organic traffic from Google were decreased in 4 times!

I never used any kind of dark SEO.

Anyway, It didn't hurt my sales, because all my sales are from word of mouth. When users type a name of my product it's always on #1 position (of course).
Igor Kokarev Send private email
Saturday, July 13, 2013
 
 
Igor Hi.
Mine is 11 years old.
Almost from start it was in page one.
But ever since Sep 12 till today traffic decreased to 25% from the old traffic - so now i get 25% from that traffic.  Sales decreased in the same number.

The question is if only in my niche google started to move all the commercial sites to page 2-4 and leave on page 1 only cnet, info site, youtube and blogs or you see it on your niche as well when you search for your keywords.
Not Now Send private email
Saturday, July 13, 2013
 
 
For us, the story is different. Organic traffic has increased and also our positioning on search results.
Jose Send private email
Saturday, July 13, 2013
 
 
After a closer look at data I see that that 50% drop on 6th june was preceded  by two weak increase of ~40%

Anyway it is still a big drop because I compare it with period before  those two  'good' weeks
alexandar Send private email
Monday, July 15, 2013
 
 
Same as @Igor and @NotNow.

For 11 years on page 1. Until last year when visitors decreased by 50% (was thrown beyond 3rd page due to Panda).
Gautam Jain Send private email
Monday, July 15, 2013
 
 
Jose,

We've found the same. For years we've wondered why our site that appeared to have better content was ranked below other sites which often had very poor content. We always assumed they just used better tricks than us in fooling Google. We now appear #1 for our main keywords and further down the first page for other important keywords.

I think this is a step forward for consumers. The results seem more likely to answer my query. I'm less likely to be spammed by people who target SEO instead of good content for the consumer.

SEO is now a really simple concept. As a website owner, you need:
* Good content
* Regularly updated content

Is anyone prepared to show a real example where they think a search term should return one of their pages over the actual results?
Adrian Lock Send private email
Monday, July 15, 2013
 
 
@ Adrian "is anyone prepared"
I'm prepared
alexandar Send private email
Monday, July 15, 2013
 
 
I have couple of products where when you search for exact product name (or related keyword) it is not listed even in the  first 10 pages yet it shows youtube video of mine (for that product) and in image results they are and always have been in the first 5 images.

Try googling for:
chord sequencer

That is just one example of my many products
alexandar Send private email
Monday, July 15, 2013
 
 
@alexandar: We also need to know the URL of your product, otherwise it's impossible for us to know which of those results is yours.
Richie Hindle Send private email
Monday, July 15, 2013
 
 
@ Richie
I gave enough information read carefully
alexandar Send private email
Monday, July 15, 2013
 
 
@alexandar: I'd remove /c5/index.php/ from the URL.

It is also strange that your home page immediately redirects to an URL four levels deep.

If I was Google Panda, I would not have placed such an URL at the #1 spot.
Dmitry Leskov @Home Send private email
Monday, July 15, 2013
 
 
Also, your page does not validate. I had seen the PageRank of multiple pages increased a month after I made sure they are valid HTML. That was a few years ago, though.
Dmitry Leskov @Home Send private email
Monday, July 15, 2013
 
 
@ Also, your page does not validate.
Show me a site that passes validation test..even this exacpt page as simple as it is has 99 errors on it:
http://tinyurl.com/q9dk4lj

Yours has errors too
alexandar Send private email
Monday, July 15, 2013
 
 
Not to mention google:
http://tinyurl.com/opx5txt
alexandar Send private email
Monday, July 15, 2013
 
 
And this is what search results look on unburdened search engines who do their job honestly:
yahoo:
http://tinyurl.com/o95rsro

bing:
http://tinyurl.com/ncggd6q
alexandar Send private email
Monday, July 15, 2013
 
 
@alexandar: Assuming the URL that you're being so coy about is desk***metro****.com, it comes up first for me at https://www.google.com/search?q=chord+sequencer (which is why I was confused earlier).

Interestingly, I now find that it only comes up first if I'm logged into Google.  If I log out, it plummets.  Log back in again, it's #1 again.  Obviously you need to persuade your prospects to log in as me.  :-)
Richie Hindle Send private email
Monday, July 15, 2013
 
 
I'm not coy , it is just that I have acquired so much fear of google that I don't want my links anywhere...

Because i worked hard a month or so in getting links (not using any shady tactics,nice links answering strictly related questions on forums and blogs ) and as a reward I got, well, almost a ban from google


And yes it is desktopm....com and it doesn't show here no matter logged in or out of google
alexandar Send private email
Monday, July 15, 2013
 
 
On a similar note... I had a program containing word 'quick' in its name and it wasn't serious job of mine at all but soon it was bought buy a gay whose  second name was 'Quick'.
I asked him how he found the application and he answers that he did a search for 'how to learn songs' which was in my keywords but the application never ranked at all. But for this guy it was on top because somehow google figured that the guys' name was 'quick' and presented him with this...
Now it might have been a coincidence..but what a coincidence than
alexandar Send private email
Monday, July 15, 2013
 
 
> And yes it is desktopm....com and it doesn't show here no matter logged in or out of google

I wonder why you believe that page should rank well for that term?

When I just look at the page, the words "chord sequence" are not in any of the titles or subtitles. They are mentioned on the page, but in the ordinary text, nothing outstanding by neither size or color.

How would Google know this page is more about chord sequence than about chord pad?

To my untrained look, the main keyword for the page is "Chord Pad". It is in the first title on the page. It is outlined with color later.  It has a link to download with the same name.

And indeed, this page ranked #1 for "Chord Pad" in my google search.

...

I do not think it is time to blame Google yet.
Vladimir Dyuzhev Send private email
Monday, July 15, 2013
 
 
> Yours has errors too

Mine is not a commercial site, and it ranks #1 for my name. Actually, Google get the entire first page 90% accurately, showing my LinkedIn, StackOverflow, GitHub, etc. profiles, and some other Dmitry Leskov's  Facebook profile.

 Anyway,  thanks for letting me know.
Dmitry Leskov @Home Send private email
Tuesday, July 16, 2013
 
 
@ Vladimir "I wonder why you believe that page should rank well for that term? How would Google know this page is more about chord sequence than about chord pad?"

Because I used to rank on the top for the same page.
How do bing and yahoo know?
alexandar Send private email
Tuesday, July 16, 2013
 
 
> Because I used to rank on the top for the same page.

Google used to have a more primitive algorithm. Now it has changed.

It is useless to look back. If you want to rank well again, you need to change your page.

I'm not claiming any specific knowledge of what to do. I'm just saying that on my human look your page shouldn't rank well for that term. I just do not perceive that page to be about "chord sequencer".

> How do bing and yahoo know?

Bing and Yahoo are mistaken. They are playing the catch up game with Google, will try to improve their quality, and may too low-rank the page just as Google does.
Vladimir Dyuzhev Send private email
Thursday, July 18, 2013
 
 
****
SEO is now a really simple concept. As a website owner, you need:
* Good content
* Regularly updated content
****

You'd think it was that simple but anyone from any segment can give you an example where this isn't the case.  Right now there's a website in my segment that is top 5 for almost any relevant keyword you can imagine.  The site is selling a product, has about 12 pages of content that hasn't changed for a  long time, is riddled with adsense ads and is full of bad English.  Even better the link profile shows a quadrupling of links to the site from mostly un-related domains in the last few months. And still there it sits.

Mind you the site that is top in my niche is beautiful, well written, and (despite them being a competitor) seems to thoroughly deserve their position.
Mark Nemtsas Send private email
Friday, July 19, 2013
 
 
Low season notwithstanding, Google has driven over 50% more traffic to our articles over the last week than over any of the preceding four weeks (when it stayed flat).

The US traffic specifically has doubled.

Hopefully, quality content is king again.
Dmitry Leskov Send private email
Monday, July 22, 2013
 
 
Hello.
As we all know, google has bought companies like youtube. Without fear, I must say that this is the reason that these businesses, not the software, now appear first in organic search. In fact, I now find it more difficult to keep positioned my websites.
Gushosoft Send private email
Thursday, July 25, 2013
 
 

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