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Andy Brice
Successful Software

Doug Nebeker ("Doug")

Jonathan Matthews
Creator of DeepTrawl, CloudTrawl, and LeapDoc

Nicholas Hebb
BreezeTree Software

Bob Walsh
host, Startup Success Podcast author of The Web Startup Success Guide and Micro-ISV: From Vision To Reality

Patrick McKenzie
Bingo Card Creator

Adwords suggestion ?


After searching through this forum archive, I found that some  people says adwords is just a waste of dollars, but other says its good and they achieve result. However, since there are many posting that do not include the website/product/service info by the op (many is anonymous), I do not know what kind of product/service is suitable for adwords and not suitable.

The problem is that I am planning to go through adwords advertising, I am looking forward for any suggestion.

url: http://www.kiyut.com

I have two products in there:
1) Sketsa SVG Graphics Editor. Currently it is our primary revenue generator. It is a niche products, few competitor, 1 very big open source competitor inkscape, market is small (SVG is not that popular). Current price $99

2) Citra FX Image Filter. It is a new product just 3 month olds. Market is very big but saturated. Current price $29

So the questions are:
1) Is it worth to go through the google adwords campaign, for above type of products ?
2) If it is worth, which product Sketsa or Citra, or Both ?
3) for sketsa, it is google pr 6, many svg related keyword bring our page into 1st / 2nd page on google search, do I still need adwords ?
4) I am going to test the water but have limited budget, any budget suggestion $500 or 1000 or 2000 a month just to test the water ?
5) Any other alternative promotion campaign other than adwords
6) any other suggestion ?

Kiyut Send private email
Wednesday, July 25, 2007
It takes 10 minutes to set up. Just put whatever budget you want (start with a buck a day--what's it hurt?).
my name is here
Wednesday, July 25, 2007
correction: it may take 10 minutes to set up, but hours and hours to really understand what you are doing, and even more to hone it. I believe it is worth it.
Wednesday, July 25, 2007
I have just recently expanded my Adwords advertising through assistance of several others on this forum.  With what I have been learning, my monthly Adwords spend went from $350/month to $1000/month while sales have increased significantly.

A few tips that I have found:

== Hundreds of Keywords in Logical Groups ==
Don't just pick a dozen keywords and go.  The more keywords you have, the more traffic you can bring in. 

== Conversion Tracking ==
If you use Adwords, be sure and setup your conversion tracking so you can tell which keywords work for you.  Getting hundreds of clicks is useless if they fail to convert.

== Landing Pages ==
Don't just drop users off at your home page.  Design effective landing pages specific to your keyword groups.  Use Google Website Optimizer (free) to test out variations on your landing pages to find your highest converting version.

== Analytics ==
Use something like Google Analytics to know where your traffic comes from, where they go on your site, and where they leave.  In the beginning, I found that over 75% of visitors left my trial registration form without filling it out!

== Organic SEO ==
Have good SEO on your pages and you will get good traffic without having to pay by the click

Though you can get started and test the waters in under a half hour, I found I really got my high returns when I spent a significant amount of time learning the system.
Terrell Send private email
Wednesday, July 25, 2007
I suggest that this site is worth reading re adwords:


I've never used them, nor do I have anything to do with this company, but their adwords newsletter seems valuable, here:


And I found this podcast where their guy Dave Collins is interviewed (mostly regarding adwords) had quite a good signal to noise ratio (there is a transcript at the bottom of the page):

Mark V Send private email
Wednesday, July 25, 2007
3) for sketsa, it is google pr 6, many svg related keyword bring our page into 1st / 2nd page on google search, do I still need adwords ?
4) I am going to test the water but have limited budget, any budget suggestion $500 or 1000 or 2000 a month just to test the water ?


#3)  Even if you are #1 on the first page on Google, AdWords will bring you extra clicks by the simple expedient of increasing screen real estate.  Assuming clicks are profitable for you, there is no reason why you shouldn't get as many as you can get your hands on.

#4)  What does a click cost in your market?  For just dipping your toe in the water, you can use a budget that gets a couple dozen clicks a day, and then gradually walk up your budget as you get up AdWords' very, very painful learning curve.  ("The defaults are set to make money for Google, not for you" <- most important advice I've ever heard on AdWords.)
Patrick McKenzie Send private email
Thursday, July 26, 2007
Making a profit with adwords with a $29 product in a saturated markey could be tough. Making a profit with adwords with a $99 product in a niche market should be much easier.

As a starting point I would advise you to:
-start with search only (not content) text ads (no image/video etc)
-set a maximum budget of $5-10 per day to start with
-set up conversion tracking
-split test different ads
-only advertise in US/Europe/Austalia/Canada etc - ads in China/India etc are a waste of money
Andy Brice Send private email
Thursday, July 26, 2007
Before you start throwing crazy money into Google's pocket, wait until, on average, you're making more money off a click than it's costing you.

Mind you, I've got a niche B2B product and, after a year of testing the water, I'm still trying to get a conversion rate that'll make throwing money at Adwords worthwhile - possibly I'm not doing it right...
MB Send private email
Thursday, July 26, 2007
In related to my quest on adwords, did anyone here have experience with overture ? Does it good ? how does it compare with adwords ?

Seems like adwords is more popular here, why is that ? is it because cheaper and easier to set up ? How about the complexiity ?

Kiyut Send private email
Thursday, July 26, 2007
Adwords is much better designed and thought out than YSM (formally overture) or MS Adcentre and also gets a lot more traffic. I am currently trying out AdCentre, but its painful (more details on the blog). I gave up on YSM a long time ago.
Andy Brice Send private email
Thursday, July 26, 2007
I got better results dumping Google Ad Words entirely! My sales have slowly increased for some strange reason now. I tried many different budgets and strategies using Google tools and never got any decent results. After I stopped using Google and focused more on my web site content and plain free search enhancements, I saw much more solid results.

I say analyze your log files on your web server and get a feel for how your web site is doing selling your products. Plain old fashioned SEO and freeware marketing has paid off for me. In the end, Google isnt selling anmything for you....its what your web pages say to the human element in convincing them to take a risk and buy your products that counts.

Your not selling to search engines....youre selling to people! For that reason, I say dump Google Ad Words entirely!
Monday, July 30, 2007

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